Sociopath/Pychopath/Empath | Forum

1. Superficial charm & good intelligence.

2. Absence of delusions. Rational.

3. Absence of nervousness or neurotic manifestations.

4. Unreliable. - to a degree I guess.

5. Untruthfulness and Insincerity. - not so much untruthfulness as much as insincerity, in that my interactions with others tend to be in the sense of going with the motions more or less.

6. Lack of remorse and shame.

9. Pathological egocentricity and incapacity for love. - personally I wouldn't necessarily say pathological.

10. Poverty in affect.

12. Unresponsive in interpersonal relations.

Why 'symptoms'? that makes it sound like a disease, I prefer to use traits instead, as in character traits, leaving the implication that "psychopath" is merely another type of human, or something like that. Not pathological as commonly believed, just different from your average person, even better than in a sense.

Quote from ShadowLover @Grimey. They are the sociopathic traits. Did you watch the film? If so did you like it?

Quote from FraterLuciferi Psychopathy and sociopathy are aspects of the antisocial personality disorder (APD. 

The symptoms are... 

Failure to conform to social norms with respect to lawful behaviors as indicated by repeatedly performing acts that are grounds for arrest 

Deceitfulness, as indicated by repeated lying, use of aliases, or conning others for personal profit or pleasure 

Impulsivity or failure to plan ahead Irritability and aggressiveness, as indicated by repeated physical fights or assaults 

Reckless disregard for safety of self or others 

Consistent irresponsibility, as indicated by repeated failure to sustain consistent work behavior or honor financial obligations 

Lack of remorse

Because of the lack of self awareness and a lot of psychological projections then people with APD can't see they have a personal disorder and that's the greatest problem with them...

Despite what the so called experts opine about something they know nothing about, apart from their guess work, all "psychopaths" aren't all uniformly the same, just as all non "psychopaths" or "sociopaths" if you prefer aren't at all uniformly the same. For instance, it's implied that "Failure to conform to social norms with respect to lawful behaviors as indicated by repeatedly performing acts that are grounds for arrest" is a compulsive thing done by each and every "psychopath" on the planet and that's akin to racism and such as that, in that saying because a select few of these individuals who are and have been incarcerated at the time of doctor know it all, conducting his study are known to have done arrestful things doesn't make for the argument of the uniformity of each and every "psychopath" on the collective level.  

I take issue with 'disorder', just because the vast majority of the population aren't characterized by any of these things alleged to be disorders, does not mean those who are characterized so are in some way disordered. And no, doctor know it all's degree does not make the blue sky purple, just because he insists that it is, while invoking his degree as credibility for his claim of the blue sky being purple, or that everyone who jumps up and down on one leg is normal, because the greatest number of people are doing it, leaving those who don't jump up and down on one leg being called disordered. See what I'm saying here?

On the other hand... I was talking to a medicine man (Lakota) many, many years ago and he said that in tribal days they harnessed the energy of the psychopath. In other words, if somebody was recognised during childhood of being psychopathic they were steered in a direction that would benefit the community. They were raised to fight in the front-line - he called them dog soldiers. He said they would use their anger and violence in war and dog soldiers would slash through the enemy with an infernal force. They were then praised by the tribe for their gift which egocentrics crave and so they are satisfied. Round pegs in round holes... They burn hot and fast. often dying young because they embraced battle without fear (psychopaths are too arrogant to feel fear). 
So basically, even if somebody is defective, that defectivenss need not be wasted. Just like some schitzophenic people who are highly intelligent and very empathic - they are often gifted psychics and visionaries because they have the ability to think outside of the square, unlike people who are completely locked into logic.
Also we are talking grey scales... We have markers, but I am sure we can all claim any number of markers on any list.
Overall, I don't think as a society we utilise all our resources as well as we could. 

Quote from FraterLuciferi Ol' grimey: Not all people with APD have all the symptoms but you have a lot of them...

Quote from ShadowLover I understand what you are saying about psychopathy not being a disorder. I am of two minds about that. On one had I feel they were born defective in that they are not capable of empathy. This makes them very angry and violent, as with regular people that lose the ability to physically feel. I believe that is why they are so attracted to people who are extremely empathic - because they subconsciously seek the empathic glow that they don't themselves have. They torture and kill because they like to possess feelings - it is the only way they can experience them. Feelings fascinate them. 

On the other hand... I was talking to a medicine man (Lakota) many, many years ago and he said that in tribal days they harnessed the energy of the psychopath. In other words, if somebody was recognised during childhood of being psychopathic they were steered in a direction that would benefit the community. They were raised to fight in the front-line - he called them dog soldiers. He said they would use their anger and violence in war and dog soldiers would slash through the enemy with an infernal force. They were then praised by the tribe for their gift which egocentrics crave and so they are satisfied. Round pegs in round holes... They burn hot and fast. often dying young because they embraced battle without fear (psychopaths are too arrogant to feel fear). 
So basically, even if somebody is defective, that defectivenss need not be wasted. Just like some schitzophenic people who are highly intelligent and very empathic - they are often gifted psychics and visionaries because they have the ability to think outside of the square, unlike people who are completely locked into logic.
Also we are talking grey scales... We have markers, but I am sure we can all claim any number of markers on any list.
Overall, I don't think as a society we utilise all our resources as well as we could. 

Yeah, of course every one hits any number of markers, but when a person hits like twelve out of sixteen or somewhere around there, then that says something. What I said just now reminds me of the book called Wisdom Of Psychopaths and a related documentary.  as for your assessment that feelings fascinate the "psycho/sociopath", I'll give an example of where I stand on that issue. When it comes to the feelings of others I tend to find them to be bizarre, take the feeling of grief as an example, when I witness someone after a person close to them has died, especially if it was their kid, I look at how hard they take it and is affected by it for a whole life time and I  think. "jeez, get over it already, shit happens. You should've been over that like two seconds after it happened". And I do look at their state/behavior as an annoyance, or whatever. I hate to be in the same room with grieving people, what with all that somber unnecessary energy filling the air smothering me. personally, I look at the death of someone whom society deems close to me or a 'loved" one as breaking a dish and if I was somewhat fond of them, a broken dish that I liked, then I say, "Meh".     If you ask me, I would say that so called psychopaths/sociopaths aren't defective at all, but rather quite higher than your average population that I'm keen on calling so called normal people, because in my estimation the average population are the defective ones.

Here's that documentary I mentioned above:

Quote from FraterLuciferi ol' grimey: Your megalomania, psychological projections and antisocial behaviours are symptoms of APD. You don't see it by yourself and that's why I will recommend you to seek a doctor.

You said
"I hate to be in the same room with grieving people, what with all that somber unnecessary energy filling the air smothering me. "
I attended a funeral yesterday btw. But what I am saying is only empaths are bothered by such situations. A psychopath isn't capable of empathy and doesn't feel the energy in the room. They can witness the expressions and know the people are sad, but they can't feel a room fill with energy and so are never bothered by it. Psychopaths are devoid of empathy.
Empaths on the other hand can be very sensitive to such emotions which is why we are often somewhat reclusive. I have always said that graveyards are far more haunted by the living than by the dead. The soil and the air is filled with tears and emotional numbness. It's horrible. That is why when my first son died 23years ago, I put his ashes in some ground in a place that nobody knew and that I would never see again. I didn't want everybody going to a place and crying and making it a sad place.
To me you sound more like a pissed off empath. ...Which is a good thing because I think it is superior to have the ability to feel and be able to control it than not to have that ability in the first place (like a psychopath). You might not like to feel, but there is a wealth of knowledge to be absorbed from feelings so embracing this ability on occasion is a powerful thing. You just have to learn to separate what is yours and what's not and dust off what is not.
What you describe you do at funerals, is the very essence of what a psychopath is not capable of.
I have a strong belief in the energy of a person transcending their dead body so I don't experience the grief that other people do. And people tie all sorts of things up with their grief - like remorse and regret. It is rarely simple the sadness of missing that they are experiencing. If I want to say something to a dead person I say it. 
When my son died I was emotionally gutted and somewhat numb - the world spun for a while. But I stopped crying a couple of years earlier - I cried so much I had no tears left. When he actually did die I had no tears and remember having to pretend to cry and behave appropriately at his funeral so I didn't appear crazy. I struggle with what is normal emotions. I'm still not one to burst into to tears. ...A good flogging helps. Lol. Or listening to some music on Youtube will fill me with emotion so that tears roll down my face. But I constantly have wet eyes when I talk to people because I feel everything.

And it is a fallacy to say that empathy and linear thinking can't go together - I am living proof that they can. Energy too, can be represented by numbers. Everything can be. I describe myself as an optimistic realist in that I can envision what is possible, simultaneously to seeing what is. I mean, that is how advances are made. Somebody has to take the leap of faith and believe something that hasn't yet been scientifically proven. These unquantified beliefs are usually grounded in feeling.

Well, yeah I recognize my empathic qualities and embrace them from since way back when and when comes to feelings, I become aware of what I'm feeling, take note of it and without particularly sifting through what's mine and not mine, I simply remain present to the feeling. I am most especially aware of others thoughts/feelings about me in particular. I am able to know when and whom is having negative sentiments about me and that's an interesting sensation and experience. Only when I'm dealing with my non empathic side, I'm aware of not having loved or felt love for any one and other significant characteristics associated with the psycho/sociopath, in short, I am all round 'other'.

You said somewhere that I am "a pissed off empath" and I don't dispute that and I know that's mine, because I have my reasons to be highly pissed off in an indignant kind of way.

Quote from FraterLuciferi ol' grimey: Now you are moving the focus away from yourself and over to me and that's what APD people does. APD people consider all other people to be wrong and it's other people's fault if something bad happens...

Quote from FraterLuciferi ol' grimey: Again you move the focus away from yourself by making excuses who have nothing to do with the case.

Quote from FraterLuciferi

Quote from ol' grimey

Quote from FraterLuciferi ol' grimey: Again you move the focus away from yourself by making excuses who have nothing to do with the case.

I am the hypothetical person in the scenario, so again I ask you how is my failings in certain areas, not the fault of anyone but me?

The point is that it's always other peoples fault in the eyes of the APD person. It has nothing to do with it can't be other people fault sometimes.

He may have developed some level of sociopathy, but frankly I'm not convinced of that either. 

Grimey, I do see evidence of empathy in you. I also see strong evidence of misogyny, which can often be mistaken for sociopathy. At any rate, I believe it is also a personality disorder which can be helped by a psychiatrist but you have to want to change. 

Misogyny markers:

1. His first approach may be as a knight in shining armour.

2. Extremely possessive - will want to know his partner's movements.

3. Obsessively jealous - won't want to share his partner with anyone including her family and will sabotage her relationships to isolate her.

4. Can't stand criticism - always on the defensive.

5. He can be exciting, fun and charismatic.

6. He is a product of a dysfunctional family - a poor relationship with his mother and an abusive or passive father.

7. Distorted view of reality.

8. Uncomfortable with feelings.

9. Contempt for other's weaknesses.

10. Problems with authority.

11. If you share a secret with him he might use it against you.

12. Unspoken threat of withdrawal if you don't comply to his wishes.

13. Hostile humour - condescension and name calling.

14. Excessively controlling.

15. Embarrasses or flatters his partner in public and cuts them down in private.

16. Demands undivided attention.

17. Sometimes cruel to animals.

18. Jekyl & Hyde personality

19. Grandoise behaviour - cocky, controlling and self-centred.

20. Sexually controlling.

21. Competitive - must win. His way or no way.

22. He believes in traditional role modelling and roles.

23. Habitual liar - likes to look like the victim.

24. Mood swings.

25. No responsibility - blames other people/things/circumstances for his behaviour.

26. Rough with partner eg. Holds hand too tight on purpose.

27. Will destroy property when angry.

28. Overly sensitive and sulks when he doesn't get his own way.

A lot of us get dealt crappy hands, but blaming others doesn't help. We are given opportunities to make decisions. We try to do the best we know how at each step but often our decisions are wrong. No regrets! You learn from each decision and try not to make the same one twice. But you move on. When you lay blame on others your focus is on them. We all do this from time to time but you have to transcend it. Shift your focus from them to yourself. It's a new day. What are you going to do for you today?

I'm not saying I am perfect because fuck knows I'm not. I fail at different stuff every day. But I don't make excuses and when I do, I quickly pull myself up and get back to being truthful with myself. I failed because of decisions I made. Or because of how I chose to react to another's decision. But then I try again because you only truly fail when you stop trying.

I went to a psychologist this year and he taught me a hippy dippy method of dealing with crap from the past whether they be fears or anger. ...Whatever. It is honestly amazing. Google EFT Tapping. The first session we did was on my deepest torture - it took a while. Maybe half an hour. I swear to god, when we were finished I couldn't stop smiling - I was brain chemically euphoric! ...High as a kite! I do it all the time now - even for little things, like when my mind is racing and I am having trouble focussing. I tap for three minutes and I'm good to go. It is awesome shit.

Quote from ShadowLover @Frater. I don't believe for one second that Grimey is a psychopath. He may want to identify with it because to do so would give him a sense of control over his life - in his head psychopathy is prestigious.

He may have developed some level of sociopathy, but frankly I'm not convinced of that either. 

Grimey, I do see evidence of empathy in you. I also see strong evidence of misogyny, which can often be mistaken for sociopathy. At any rate, I believe it is also a personality disorder which can be helped by a psychiatrist but you have to want to change. 

Misogyny markers:

1. His first approach may be as a knight in shining armour.

2. Extremely possessive - will want to know his partner's movements.

3. Obsessively jealous - won't want to share his partner with anyone including her family and will sabotage her relationships to isolate her.

4. Can't stand criticism - always on the defensive.

5. He can be exciting, fun and charismatic.

6. He is a product of a dysfunctional family - a poor relationship with his mother and an abusive or passive father.

7. Distorted view of reality.

8. Uncomfortable with feelings.

9. Contempt for other's weaknesses.

10. Problems with authority.

11. If you share a secret with him he might use it against you.

12. Unspoken threat of withdrawal if you don't comply to his wishes.

13. Hostile humour - condescension and name calling.

14. Excessively controlling.

15. Embarrasses or flatters his partner in public and cuts them down in private.

16. Demands undivided attention.

17. Sometimes cruel to animals.

18. Jekyl & Hyde personality

19. Grandoise behaviour - cocky, controlling and self-centred.

20. Sexually controlling.

21. Competitive - must win. His way or no way.

22. He believes in traditional role modelling and roles.

23. Habitual liar - likes to look like the victim.

24. Mood swings.

25. No responsibility - blames other people/things/circumstances for his behaviour.

26. Rough with partner eg. Holds hand too tight on purpose.

27. Will destroy property when angry.

28. Overly sensitive and sulks when he doesn't get his own way.

Quote from ShadowLover As far as the boy in the story... What is he doing today to help himself. The past is the past. What is he doing today?

A lot of us get dealt crappy hands, but blaming others doesn't help. We are given opportunities to make decisions. We try to do the best we know how at each step but often our decisions are wrong. No regrets! You learn from each decision and try not to make the same one twice. But you move on. When you lay blame on others your focus is on them. We all do this from time to time but you have to transcend it. Shift your focus from them to yourself. It's a new day. What are you going to do for you today?

I'm not saying I am perfect because fuck knows I'm not. I fail at different stuff every day. But I don't make excuses and when I do, I quickly pull myself up and get back to being truthful with myself. I failed because of decisions I made. Or because of how I chose to react to another's decision. But then I try again because you only truly fail when you stop trying.

I went to a psychologist this year and he taught me a hippy dippy method of dealing with crap from the past whether they be fears or anger. ...Whatever. It is honestly amazing. Google EFT Tapping. The first session we did was on my deepest torture - it took a while. Maybe half an hour. I swear to god, when we were finished I couldn't stop smiling - I was brain chemically euphoric! ...High as a kite! I do it all the time now - even for little things, like when my mind is racing and I am having trouble focussing. I tap for three minutes and I'm good to go. It is awesome shit.