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AntonDahmer
AntonDahmer Mar 20 '17
I've often had it explained to me that satanism and laveyan in particular is best used as a temporary tool in deprogramming your mind away from the fear and guilt religion teaches us, once this has been accomplished then you will be properly suited to carve your own path in the occult/LHP. After reading and practising the philosophy of LaVeyan satanism i now understand the message that these individuals were trying to get across, and I now feel ready for the rest of my occult journey. My question is what academic texts could you recommend to someone new exploring these things?
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AntonDahmer
AntonDahmer Mar 21 '17

Quote from FraterLuciferi I consider the satanic bible to be the greatest failure of modern Satanism as it has only created misconceptions about Satanism. The satanic bible was only a provocation against the conservative Christian groups in a time when the hippie movements was on a high level. The satanic bible is useless IMO and should be burned... 

Satanists are born to be their own gods so they shapes their own moral, values, philosophy and occult systems they find practical useful to guide their destiny. 

You can not intertwine everything that self indentifies as "satanism" into the same group. I would admit that the last parts of the satanic bible is mostly provocation methods but if you think that the first philosophical half is useless and should be burned as well, then I would wonder if you have actually read it.
AntonDahmer
AntonDahmer Mar 22 '17

Quote from FraterLuciferi
Quote from AntonDahmer
You can not intertwine everything that self indentifies as "satanism" into the same group. I would admit that the last parts of the satanic bible is mostly provocation methods but if you think that the first philosophical half is useless and should be burned as well, then I would wonder if you have actually read it.

LaVey promotes in TSB a philosophy that incorporates elements from social-darwinism, Ayn Rand and Crowley who has nothing to do with Satanism. The system of ritual magick in TSB has nothing to do with Satanism either because it comes from western occultism that some Satanists applies and has done through the ages. The problem with TSB is that it misleads people to believe that Satanism has a bible or manifest that describes the satanic beliefs and practice. LaVey also confuses Satan with Pan who are not the same in mythology. The satanic bible was relevant in the time of the hippie movement but today it only creates trouble...



To be clear my original response was that philosophy in certain parts of the satanic bible would be useful to the general public who are not exposed to anything like it. I disagree with you, but even if those people had nothing to do with satanism what does that have to do with me saying the book isn't disserving of being burned?
AntonDahmer
AntonDahmer Mar 23 '17

Quote from FraterLuciferi
Quote from Joshua Noctis Anton LaVey would like a word with you.

He knew it deep inside and he knew that if he did not created CoS someone else would have done it because of the time of the hippie movement...
It seems that the opposing movement to the "hippie movement" would have been hardcore, strictly materialistic atheism and not LaVeyan Satanism.
AntonDahmer
AntonDahmer Mar 23 '17

Quote from FraterLuciferi
Quote from AntonDahmer
It seems that the opposing movement to the "hippie movement" would have been hardcore, strictly materialistic atheism and not LaVeyan Satanism.

The point is that LaVey lived in the right time at 
history and the right place even to create CoS... The satanic bible was only titled that to provoke the conservative Christians...
Yes but I think you don't quite understand that provoking conservative Christians was also a big incentive of the hippie movement, afterwards they forgot their acid dropping days and became moralists like their parents.
Dracula's temple
Dracula's temple Mar 23 '17
Well to follow your path when I think of this I think of 2 different directions in life. The first direction one could take to follow there path is to walk on the earth and gain earthy knowledge. But another path one would take is to follow there spiritual path, Wich is, iny case. My lord. Even my lord is spiritual. Just as the Christians lord.but I still have to walk with a spiritual mindset. Even thou I am a son of the dark one. Sometimes one has to choose Wich way is they going to take. Even thou I am not of the Christian god my god is a spiritual god still. And I.have chooses to be spiritual. But not that of Jesus. 
RileyHeadwind
RileyHeadwind May 12 '17
Going off the original post, I'd have to totally agree. After I found Satanism and read the Satanic Bible, it opened my eyes to way more things in the occult and really allowed me to carve my own spiritual journey.
nith
nith May 19 '17

After reading all of the above it brings to light a question or two,,,

Is this path you talk about an action or reaction?


Do your constructs become something new that is built from a solid foundation or are they just rearranged to fit you likes and dislikes?


While I have nothing against the Satanic Bible and what followed on that string, I found many of Bruce Lee's books more left hand path than it. Does this mean I start a new religion called Lee-ism, no it does not. The idea that a book that says nothing is sacred becomes sacred to some is more than a little funny.


If all of your eggs (understanding) come from the same basket (book) then maybe it needs rethinking. In fact if all of your understanding is referenced by books I would recommend moving from theory to practice.


Path baby steps; Start with finding out who you are without all the outside telling you who to be.

The Forum post is edited by nith May 19 '17
PIGEON666/questforsweaters@gmail.com
I highly recommend to you a book called "Astonish Yourself! 101 Experiments in the Philosophy of Everyday Life" By Roger-Pol Droit. It's not overtly Satanist in any way, but utilizes the Satanic rule of becoming your own philosopher/god in this Earthly world. The book leads you through a series of "experiments", which in essence are simply questions you're meant to ask and answer for yourself. 


It's the most practical piece I've come upon. All it does is open your mind, and it's up to you where that leads. A perfect fit for the everyday Satanist!!!

Cyrus
Cyrus May 30 '17
As Satanists we are (or should be) endlessly curious, constantly challenging ourselves, and never assuming we know all the answers.  Therefore it is good to start with books that get our creative and critical and philosophical engines running, and then keep moving.  Even if someone wrote "the perfect book" expressing Satanic concepts better than anyone ever before, we would still need to grow ourselves by reading other books and trying other thoughts.  So sure, use TSB as a starting point, why not; but it might as well be any other book that challenges your internal programming.

As far as other texts for the next step on your path, I highly recommend the complete works of Idries Shah, and "Be Here Now" by Ram Dass.  Both are believers in, and promoters of, religions that are not Satanism. But both of them cut deeply past dogma, and both teach concepts that can free the mind and develop the depth and breadth of the spiritual person, including on the Left Hand Path.
Cyrus
Cyrus May 30 '17
Also the complete works of Hakim Bey, AKA Peter Lamborn Wilson.
Knievel74 Member
Knievel74 Jun 12 '17

Quote from AntonDahmer I've often had it explained to me that satanism and laveyan in particular is best used as a temporary tool in deprogramming your mind away from the fear and guilt religion teaches us, once this has been accomplished then you will be properly suited to carve your own path in the occult/LHP. After reading and practising the philosophy of LaVeyan satanism i now understand the message that these individuals were trying to get across, and I now feel ready for the rest of my occult journey. My question is what academic texts could you recommend to someone new exploring these things?
As far as the occult goes in terms of practicing magic I can't recommend anything, but if you mean finding your own path then I would read Nietzsche. I just finished Thus Spoke Zarathustra and really enjoyed it. Or even Joseph Campbell. Their books aren't Satanic but nonetheless they write about self discovery. 
VVOTAN-XIV
VVOTAN-XIV Jun 24 '17
I would not advise anyone to go down Howard's Jew pantomime Satanism path. 
Zoramonkey Member
Zoramonkey Jun 30 '17

Quote from W.O.T.A.N I would not advise anyone to go down Howard's Jew pantomime Satanism path. 

Oy Vey someone has never read Satan speaks. But yea, Lavey does not own Satanism but neither does anyone else. To be fair the first mention of Satan is in the Torah.
VVOTAN-XIV
VVOTAN-XIV Jun 30 '17
As far as I am concerned the guy was responsible for turning the occult into a fucking joke, that tolerates fags, liberals and nonce deviants, hell bent on their own destruction by indulgence.


In centuries gone by we would have these Lavey fags drowned in the mud and sacrificed. 

The Forum post is edited by VVOTAN-XIV Jun 30 '17
Zoramonkey Member
Zoramonkey Jun 30 '17

Quote from W.O.T.A.N.X.I.V As far as I am concerned the guy was responsible for turning the occult into a fucking joke, that tolerates fags, liberals and nonce deviants, hell bent on their own destruction by indulgence.


In centuries gone by we would have these Lavey fags drowned in the mud and sacrificed. 

Being a fag,a liberal, and a big fan of tolerance I may be a bit biased in this case but I do agree about the whole thin skin self destructive aspect. As a student of history I notice that there is a point in where just about every type of individual was either burned at the stake or hung or at least harmed in some way just for existing. Shit happens and real history is a rough place. It can be a it hard on tender ideologies that are not tough enough to defend themselves without apology.
VVOTAN-XIV
VVOTAN-XIV Jul 1 '17
Modern "Satanists" have never been persecuted properly, and for the most part they put themselves in the firing line with their degenerate behaviour. It hasn't really stood the test of time, and it shows. I respect Christians more than these modern day pantomime Satanists. At least they are persecuted and continue to stand strong despite.


Zoramonkey Member
Zoramonkey Jul 1 '17

Quote from W.O.T.A.N.X.I.V Modern "Satanists" have never been persecuted properly, and for the most part they put themselves in the firing line with their degenerate behaviour. It hasn't really stood the test of time, and it shows. I respect Christians more than these modern day pantomime Satanists. At least they are persecuted and continue to stand strong despite.


I guess you were not around in the 80s. The weren't burning us at the stake but there was some real persecution in that we had people calling our jobs and trying to get children taken away from parents and breaking up marriages. The harassment from the police was so bad many of them would know what we had for dinner two hours later when they stopped us making a trip to the convenience store to get soda or cigarettes. I could easily go on but if you look at the videos available on you tube that law enforcement was using at the time you will see what I mean. While you do this keep in mind that while this was going on RM was considered to be legitimate so there were people who were even facing legal charges for things they never did and even concerning people they never met. Popular culture was hostile too. Things are very different now. So I guess I would have disagree that we were never persecuted properly. I do not know any Christian old enough to remember any real Christian persecution, since most of it happened in the late roman empire and early dark ages. Are you trolling? Just curious.
Troll Member
Troll Jun 13

AntonDahmer:

> ...satanism and laveyan in particular is best used as a temporary 

> tool in deprogramming your mind away from the fear and guilt

> religion teaches us, 

Almost. It isn't the whole of those it is the Black Mass that does that. After you've freed yourself then pursue your own pleasures and never look back.


> ...carve your own path in the occult/LHP. 

Unnecessary. Most won't have the aptitude for it and will be wasting their time. Instead, they should be pursuing ordinary pleasures and ignoring what they've been told (like you're continuing to tell them) is what they want and will make them happy.


> ...my occult journey. 

This sounds like Setianism or some Hermetic trip. Occultism is just tricks to get what you want using symbolism, subtle influence, and keying to particular unknown harmonics like sex and trapezoids.


> ...what academic texts could you recommend to someone new

> exploring these things?

I wouldn't, for someone new who is typing like you, but if you insisted, i'd recommend that you look for "Contemporary Religious Satanism" edited by Petersen. If that suited you well enough and this was what you were searching for, then try "The Devil's Party", eds. Faxneld and Petersen. If you were serious about learning about its backdrop, then get "The Satanism Scare", eds. Best, Richardson, and Bromley.

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