I've just stumbled upon this article:
Confronting My Cyberbully 13 Years Later.
The woman was bullied via email by her former friend at school. And though it happened when she was 13 years old, she not only still remembers it after 13 years but she also seems to be still affected by it. Is she justified in her emotional reactions? Or is she simply playing a victim card?
Do you think cyberbullying or online harassment is a serious problem or is it a myth perpetuated by the media? Why do people harass others online?
Sometimes, it's hard to tell a difference between a vivid discussion and harassment. Should there be any limits to the freedom of posting on the internet? Or do people have a right to say whatever they want to others online?
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Cyberbullying | Forum
Zero
Oct 1 '14
Freedom of speech should be for all platforms. Even the internet.
Goading people into killing themselves (especially young impressionable children), stalking people and threatening people with physical harm, or blackmail is really a rather cruel act in my opinion.
Bullying isn't a nice thing to go through for anyone.
However hard the pain and torment is, the victim has three choices and only three. Stand up and fight back, or let them beat you down till you cannot get back up. The third is killing yourself to escape it.
I think it IS a serious problem, but how do you police it? The simple answer is that it cannot be policed. You cannot put rules and regulations on freedom of thought.
It is up to the individual person to either act like a punk, or be good to his/her fellow human being.
*Edited Note*
I want to add that a remark taken in jest towards one person, will be taken as an insult to another. It really does depend on the "victim", and the perpetrator.
The Forum post is edited by Zero Oct 1 '14
Chapter Head JamesSTL
Oct 1 '14
There will always be those individuals who want to burn the world down because their mother didn't hug them enough.
Bullying is a symptom of weakness.
Chapter Head johnnywatts
Oct 1 '14
People have the right to say whatever they want online. To do otherwise would violate the basic human right to free speech and expression.
If anything, the Internet is one of the last few places where true stratification takes place. People are dicks, especially if they have a monitor to hide behind.
That's just how it is, and no amount of SJWing is going to change it, simply because you can never convince the entire population of 3 billion Internet users to stick to your rules. Even if 99.9% of the population agrees to not be dicks, that's still 3 million dicks roaming the Internet.
Even if say, you force the Internet to play nice via draconian legislation, you just can't win. Hacking is already illegal as hell, as is child pornography, drugs, assassins, etc.
Guess what all the people involved in those did? They either moved to Russia, or moved to the Darknet. The FBI took years of work to take down ONE Darknet website selling drugs (Google Silk Road), and there are thousands more offering child porn, assassinations, drugs, etc.
Technology has outstripped the government's ability to enforce the rules completely. Should the current Darknet (the Onion Network/TOR) be compromised, I would not be surprised at all if a new form of "Darknet" is born from it.
I am in agreement with luz. Instead of trying to convince people, either by reason or by force, to not be dicks, focus on raising as many individuals as possible who aren't susceptible to cyber bullying tactics.
Maybe, just MAYBE, a simple lesson on Facebook's privacy settings will go much further to end cyber bullying than any legislation.
e.g., you'd never find me on Facebook unless I wanted you to. It's just a few settings on Facebook that they don't tell you about unless you go read about it.
Oh, and an awareness of the nature of the Internet would help too.
Chapter Head johnnywatts
Oct 2 '14
There is no 1st amendment online. It is up to the host what rules are legislated and upheld.Of course. However, it's illegal for the government specifically to step in and say all hosts must uphold these new laws preventing certain forms of speech and expression. At least, it'll face some significant opposition in doing so. Such laws are really one of the only ways to mostly (not entirely) stop cyber bullying.
Leaving it up the hosts just means there'll be huge variations. e.g., on SIN, stratification is in effect. i.e., each must stand their own, and there will be no false assumption of equality (at least, that's what I understand by the term "stratification"). Try going to Reddit's /r/Feminism and say, "You people here are not inherently my equal". You must find your own level. Watch how quickly shit hits the proverbial fan.
P.S. >> Just to be clear, in case the thread gets derailed, I picked /r/Feminism because feminists are one of the ones making the most noise these days in the media. Not because I believe women are inferior. Just to be clear.
The Forum post is edited by johnnywatts Oct 2 '14
Anna
Oct 2 '14
And can you really visualize standing up and fighting back against a pack of trolls on the internet?
I think there is a significant difference between trolling and cyberbullying. We must draw the line somewhere. I mean... if I call someone a fucking idiot during some heated debate, is this bullying or harassment? While online drama can be harmless and entertaining at times, real online harassment can make you develop stomach ulcers. Just imagine some psychotic dick stalking you on all online venues you're on, posting nasty things about you all over the net and sending you death threats via email. Since he's anonymous, you can't be sure whether he's joking or not. You don't know him but he knows you and he posts your personal data in many online places so it's enough to google your name and see what bullshit is there about you.
Now it's a bit different from a few douchebags shit talking you on a forum, blog or Facebook. You can put an end to this by logging out of the place whereas harassment doesn't simply go away. Whenever you switch on your computer, it's there and it does affect your daily life. Most of the time, stalking and harassment are done by people the victim knows; former partners or friends.
One example of harassment I got from the Fetlife forum. A woman was on video chat with her S/M partner. She undressed for him several times but she wasn't aware he recorded her. He also knew her true name. One day he asked for her address. She hesitated because she had a husband and then he started threatening her. He posted her photos and chat recordings on several porn websites. She signed up for Fetlife.com and begged for some help and advice. She was really devastated. People advised her to tell her husband about everything and go to the police. I think she learned her lesson the hard way.
The Forum post is edited by Anna Oct 2 '14
Anna
Oct 2 '14
While online drama can be harmless and entertaining at timesSure, if you are at the right side of it.
My dear, I enjoy the drama at both ends. It's like sex. Whether on top or bottom, whether from the front or from behind, it always rocks. ;)
Guess who
Oct 3 '14
Yes, people should be able to say whatever they want on the internet. The "dangers" of cyberbullying can be real depending on the person, but are extremely exaggerated by the media and public schools anti-bullying programs.
I've been cyberbullied before. On a website called ask.fm, one of my classmates repeatedly sent me messages/questions with offensive remarks, such as the typical "ur a fag" or "go kill yourself." It wasn't a big deal at all (for me). Given that I am usually bored I actually kind of enjoyed screwing around with him on the internet, Even if his insults were occasionally hurtful. Yet, some people get bullied and cannot handle it at all. It depends on their sensitivity and how seriously they take other people's comments.
The reason for doing it can be different from case to case. My bully primarily did it for social status, and it seemed he had a strange interest in my reactions to his comments.
I've been cyberbullied before. On a website called ask.fm, one of my classmates repeatedly sent me messages/questions with offensive remarks, such as the typical "ur a fag" or "go kill yourself." It wasn't a big deal at all (for me). Given that I am usually bored I actually kind of enjoyed screwing around with him on the internet, Even if his insults were occasionally hurtful. Yet, some people get bullied and cannot handle it at all. It depends on their sensitivity and how seriously they take other people's comments.
The reason for doing it can be different from case to case. My bully primarily did it for social status, and it seemed he had a strange interest in my reactions to his comments.
Chapter Head johnnywatts
Oct 4 '14
Trolls feed off your anger. That's the entire purpose. They want a rise out of you.
The reason for doing it can be different from case to case. My bully primarily did it for social status, andit seemed he had a strange interest in my reactions to his comments.
Anna
Oct 4 '14
I've been cyberbullied before. On a website called ask.fm, one of my classmates repeatedly sent me messages/questions with offensive remarks, such as the typical "ur a fag" or "go kill yourself." It wasn't a big deal at all (for me). Given that I am usually bored I actually kind of enjoyed screwing around with him on the internet, Even if his insults were occasionally hurtful. Yet, some people get bullied and cannot handle it at all. It depends on their sensitivity and how seriously they take other people's comments.
I had many nasty comments addressed to me too, though it was at times provoked. I'm not that innocent. Did it hurt? Sometimes, however my words could hurt others too. But it's not something one can't cope with. And as you said, a bit of drama can be quite entertaining. I don't really understand people who are too sensitive and easily hurt by strangers' comments.
it seemed he had a strange interest in my reactions to his comments.
The reason for online bullying is the same as for the bullying in the real world. It's the power game. Just like the kids at school cheer when they see the cornered child scared and crying, the online bullies too feel enormous satisfaction if their victim breaks down. Most of the time, it's all being done using a trial and error method. This is why your "friend" was so interested in your reactions. He just wanted to see what works on you.
Anna
Oct 21 '14
We have laws on the books in America against cyber bullying.
We have such laws in Poland too. They sound nice when you read them. But when you are actually harassed it's not that much you can do. It's possible to get your persecutor's IP, then his address and then sue him, but the legal road to it is very complicated and expensive.
The Forum post is edited by Anna Oct 21 '14
Anna
Oct 21 '14
Two Years in Prison for Trolling
There was a discussion about it on 600 Club. Now in the UK those who troll and harass others online can face two years prison sentence. The law was introduced after a series of suicides due to cyber bullying.
There was a discussion about it on 600 Club. Now in the UK those who troll and harass others online can face two years prison sentence. The law was introduced after a series of suicides due to cyber bullying.
The Forum post is edited by Anna Oct 21 '14
Anna
Oct 21 '14
A good video. I totally agree with you. An adult person should know how to deal with other people, no matter whether online or offline. In the article I linked to, the whole discussion about cyber bullying in Britain was fueled after some celebrity started receiving rape threats on Twitter. Now... isn't it the price to pay for being famous? If you are a widely-known public figure, you must be prepared to face criticism, even if it's not very elegant, even if it's vulgar and unfair.
The misfortune of the victims of harassment can be used by the government to curb the freedom of speech and it would be all done in the name of security. If the citizens can't handle their business, can't cope with each other and run to the government pleading for help, like kids to their mom, then they will have as much say as small children.
It seems that for Cameron and Company trolling equals harassment, which is not always true. Also how to tell a difference between harsh criticism and harassment? People have different levels of sensitivity. Actually, such an ambiguous law could be abused by politicians to silence the opposition.
The misfortune of the victims of harassment can be used by the government to curb the freedom of speech and it would be all done in the name of security. If the citizens can't handle their business, can't cope with each other and run to the government pleading for help, like kids to their mom, then they will have as much say as small children.
It seems that for Cameron and Company trolling equals harassment, which is not always true. Also how to tell a difference between harsh criticism and harassment? People have different levels of sensitivity. Actually, such an ambiguous law could be abused by politicians to silence the opposition.
The Forum post is edited by Anna Oct 21 '14
Member
Anna
Oct 22 '14
A girl does not just wake up and think - how romantic is to join a militant group. Instead the girl is systematically exposed to blogs, videos and conversations romanticizing the group and also pressuring her into joining them.
What does "exposure" mean here? From the article you linked to, it seems that nobody, including their parents, pressured the girls to join these networks, blogs, forums and chatrooms. They found them by themselves. What made them look for these specific websites? That's the key question. Identity crisis, perhaps? The girls were Muslims. Most of people joining ISIS are immigrants, not native Americans.
What lures Americans to Syria fight?
Over the past two years, 12 Americans have been charged with supporting militant groups fighting in Syria or have died while fighting with such groups...
The dozen Americans are a rainbow of ethnicities; of South Asian, East Asian, Caucasian, Middle Eastern and African-American descent, according to a survey by New America.
There is a huge gap between these nationalities and Americans. They are by no means Westerners. African and Asian cultures are collective as opposed to the Western culture, which is highly individualized. And Islam is not only a religion, it's also a culture, it's a way of life.
I bet, those joining ISIS or other Jihadist movements feel alienated in America, they are unable to adapt to the new culture, which is so different from their native one, or they find themselves lost between two different cultures, two different ways of life.
Brainwashing is a tricky thing. You can't just brainwash anybody. Propaganda works only if it addresses specific targets; the susceptible minds ripe for embracing certain ideas. Tulips won't grow on a desert.
The Forum post is edited by Anna Oct 22 '14
Anna
Oct 22 '14
To answer the question about who or what made them look for this sites: exactly the same that would make a teenager (or an adult) look for SIN, 600c, etc.
Not necessarily. To simplify: There are various kinds of cheese and the multitude of mice, each mouse with a taste for a different kind of cheese. Psychoanalysis and selection always precede indoctrination and propagandists and cult leaders are good people watchers. People desire many different things, be it identity, success, feeling special or chosen, stroking one's ego, acceptance, alleviating remorse or other things. Propaganda is nothing more than catching the right mouse with the right cheese.
Young people who join cults are often pissed with their parents and the whole world. All the cult leaders have to do is to strengthen the already existing hatred and frustration. How are they doing this? By telling their recruits that all people, including their parents, are wicked and already doomed and that they, as members of the sect, are the chosen ones, the elect, the few worthy of salvation among the multitude of people heading for a disaster or eternal damnation.
The Jihadists use the similar methods; glorifying Islam and condemning the Western world as worthless and corrupted. Those who kill the unfaithful are the true elite deserving the hero's laurel, paradise and the memory of posterity.
So that makes me think: what kind of brainwashing are satanic social media offering to its tulips? Maybe I should start a new topic on that...
More, you could write a PhD dissertation about it. Seriously...
Mod Orgasmic Karmatic.
Oct 25 '14
Very simply. Parents should teach children to not be dicks. And consequently, if they choose to be dicks, to remember that there is always someone out there with a bigger one.
The issue I have with online "bullying" isn't when it occurs with adults (as adults should pretty much understand the reality of the situation) but when it occurs with children. I have a very low tolerance for people bullying my children or any other children for that matter. In the long haul, you really can't teach someone to be nice. Some people just aren't.
Is there a way to prevent online bullying? I don't think so. As long as there is a screen between someone and the other person, ego inflates to the highest. Even the biggest piece of shit can be a top dog online.
The Forum post is edited by Orgasmic Karmatic. Oct 25 '14
JasinElric
Oct 25 '14
I think if someone is mature enough to have a presence on the internet, they should at least have the maturity to dismiss online pestilence. If said person is the kind of individual lacking the emotional fortitude to handle trolling, on any level of the spectrum, maybe they should adopt a more anonymous internet presence.
As far as the real world of bullying goes, it's unfortunate that many children have abusive parents, and they project that abuse onto their peers; but even more unfortunate, rather than raising our own children to handle such bullies in a rational, practical manner, we pat their crying heads and demand the world to change for our poor little victims.
Everyone wants to change the world, very rarely do people seek to change themselves. Adaptation takes a back seat to entitlement, and we're all expected to nod our heads, empathize, and cater. That unfortunate factor is responsible for much of the decline we see in our society as a whole.
JasinElric
Oct 25 '14
Bullying doesn't cover your article, that would likely be classified as mental instability. Separate issue. Even if cyber-bullying were connected, there's no evidence to support the claim that it alone, can push an otherwise mentally stable person to murder.
Bullying was a lot worse when I was growing up. It wasn't done in cyberland where it was just shit talk. From grade 6 to 9, I was jumped by large numbers of "youths". I wasn't aware of why it was taking place till around 8th grade, when one of them divulged to me, "It's white-boy day." I fought them off as best as I could, till eventually I went to High School and it stopped.
My point is, this isn't new and it's not going away. The world isn't fair and nothing you or your "community" can do will change nature. This isn't an American issue, this happens in every country, in every culture, in every class. Not that I suggest you don't try. By all means, do.
Anna
Oct 25 '14
I see cyber-bullying as an extension of face-to-face bullying.
Because the virtual world is an extension of our real world. Moreover, with the rapid advance of technology, an increasingly larger part of our life is moving online. It's not only internet on your PC but also smartphones and tablets. Many people stay connected to the internet wherever they move, especially young people, who are often addicted to the internet.
As JasinElric wrote, it's nothing new. Bullying existed long before the internet era. Only this problem wasn't so popularized or demonized by the media. Also the society wasn't so sensitive about children's problems. Now, as children spend a large portion of their time online, bullying moved online too. It's easier to harass someone online, because of anonymity. Nevertheless, from my short experience as a teacher at school and also student in the past, I can say that most children aren't monsters and the acts of bullying aren't as frequent as some media try to portray.
As for parents lacking the tech skills and often time to control what their children do online, I'm not that surprised. It's the generation gap. The parents can't keep up with the progress of technology. Parents and children are like two different worlds in that respect.
he world isn't fair and nothing you or your "community" can do will change nature.
This is the best response to Luz' questions, but I'm afraid she, like some other "experts", is not going to accept that. That yahoo article made me laugh. Not that I'm against teaching children some empathy but expecting people to be always respectful and nice to each other, come on.
