Speak for yourself. I don't exclude the possibility of shitty childhood influencing one's adulthood but it shouldn't be over-generalized. Certainly, it gets blamed too much for nealy all problems a person can have. Childhood memories are always a safe scapegoat.People with untreated trauma from childhood are often drawn to transgressive beliefs, movements and religions. I think there is a connection between childhood trauma and the drawn to Satanism or the LHP in general. The interesting thing is if Satanists or Sinisterists (if we can call all types of people on the LHP that?) have been able to use the satanic/dark rituals to handle their emotions which is why they never came in conflict with the law.
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Are Satanists born or made? | Forum
Anna
May 24 '21
Tom Riddle
May 24 '21
Speak for yourself. I don't exclude the possibility of shitty childhood influencing one's adulthood but it shouldn't be over-generalized. Certainly, it gets blamed too much for nealy all problems a person can have. Childhood memories are always a safe scapegoat.
Transgressive people have proven again and again to have untreated trauma from childhood. It have been well demonstrated in psychology. If people gets treatment for their trauma they will be less drawn to the transgressive.
Anna
May 24 '21
Transgressive people have proven again and again to have untreated trauma from childhood. It have been well demonstrated in psychology. If people gets treatment for their trauma they will be less drawn to the transgressive.Like what? I swear you're here only for the lulz.
Tom Riddle
May 24 '21
I swear you're here only for the lulz.
A need for emotional expression. This is why freedom of speech is so important in a society...
Wolfie
May 25 '21
I looked up narcissism and found the following list of symptoms.
It is definitely possible to be a Satanist and not display any of these.
- Being overly boastful, exaggerating one’s own achievements
- Pretending to be superior to others
- Lack of empathy for others
- Looking down on others as inferior
- Monopolizing conversations
- Impatient, angry, unhappy, depressed or has mood swings when criticized
- Easily disappointed when expected importance is not given
- Always craves for “the best” in everything
- Has a very fragile self-esteem
Wolfie
May 25 '21
I looked up sociopathy and learned that nowadays it's called "antisocial personality disorder."
I found the following list of symptoms.
It is definitely possible to be a Satanist and not display any of these - except the first one. If I was evaluated by a professional and I was scrupulously honest in my answers to all questions, I am sure I'd be diagnosed with the first of these symptoms, and moreover, I'd defiantly deny that I suffered from a disorder.
- Disregard of what is right
- Highly aggressive and irritable
- Deceitfulness
- Lack of empathy or remorse
- Consistently irresponsible
- Impulsive
Anna
May 25 '21
Really? Then you're a noble exception. One of the very few. For all ten years of me being around, I would diagnose the majority of the users as sociopaths or narcissists or both. But I also think that simply being an asshole or a jerk doesn't qualify as a mental disorder, especially that this is the matter of subjective judgement.I looked up narcissism and found the following list of symptoms.
It is definitely possible to be a Satanist and not display any of these.
Let me explain. With, for example, schizophrenia, you either have it or you don't. It comes with hallucinations and, without medical treatment, the patient can't function properly. It's an objective clinical condition. The same is with depression although it is also often abused. Clinical depression is a serious illness that makes people unable not only to work but also undertake simple daily activities. Often such people need to be hospitalized and they usually seek treatment of their own accord. Whereas, the above-mentioned disorders imply only personality defects and these are the defects as judged by other people.
Seriously, we reached such a level of absurdity that we can diagnose anybody with some kind of mental disorder. It's enough to point out some violation of the social etiquette and judge someone's behavior as undesirable and the diagnosis is ready. This downgrades the very concept of mental illness and makes modern psychology look more like pseudoscience than science.
The Forum post is edited by Anna May 25 '21
Tom Riddle
May 25 '21
Really? Then you're a noble exception. One of the very few. For all ten years of me being around, I would diagnose the majority of the users as sociopaths or narcissists or both. But I also think that simply being an asshole or a jerk doesn't qualify as a mental disorder, especially that this is the matter of subjective judgement.
Let me explain. With, for example, schizophrenia, you either have it or you don't. It comes with hallucinations and, without medical treatment, the patient can't function properly. It's an objective clinical condition. The same is with depression although it is also often abused. Clinical depression is a serious illness that makes people unable not only to work but also undertake simple daily activities. Often such people need to be hospitalized and they usually seek treatment of their own accord. Whereas, the above-mentioned disorders imply only personality defects and these are the defects as judged by other people.
Seriously, we reached such a level of absurdity that we can diagnose anybody with some kind of mental disorder. It's enough to point out some violation of the social etiquette and judge someone's behavior as undesirable and the diagnosis is ready. This downgrades the very concept of mental illness and makes modern psychology look more like pseudoscience than science.
Many people in this forum demonstrates personality disorders. However, lack of empathy is not only psychopaths and sociopaths. Autists and ADHD also lacks that. ADHD are also impulse. I think many in this forum have some sort of autism or Asperger syndrom. When it comes to Satanism then I think the majority who are Satanists have trauma in their childhood. It's said that the one who shocks awakes.
The Forum post is edited by Tom Riddle May 25 '21
Tom Riddle
May 25 '21
I looked up narcissism and found the following list of symptoms.
It is definitely possible to be a Satanist and not display any of these.
Symptoms of Narcissistic Personality Disorder
- Being overly boastful, exaggerating one’s own achievements
- Pretending to be superior to others
- Lack of empathy for others
- Looking down on others as inferior
- Monopolizing conversations
- Impatient, angry, unhappy, depressed or has mood swings when criticized
- Easily disappointed when expected importance is not given
- Always craves for “the best” in everything
- Has a very fragile self-esteem
Just because I worship myself as I was a god does not mean that I believe I have supernormal powers like a god. I don't know how some people can come to that misunderstanding. Being your own god simply means that there is no ideal above yourself. When you worship yourself you are not necessarily cold to anyone. You are just selective when it comes to people. I care for my family for instance because they have proven themselve worthy.
The Forum post is edited by Tom Riddle May 25 '21
Anna
May 25 '21
Many people in this forum demonstrates personality disorders. However, lack of empathy is not only psychopaths and sociopaths. Autists and ADHD also lacks that. ADHD are also impulse. I think many in this forum have some sort of autism or Asperger syndrom. When it comes to Satanism then I think the majority who are Satanists have trauma in their childhood. It's said that the one who shocks awakes.
You completely misunderstood what I wrote. I meant the new "personality disorders" are so subjective that it makes them meaningless. Basically, you can accuse anyone who violates the social norms of being a narcissist or even sociopath, including the majority of the people in this forum. Judging someone as not nice enough or downright assholish would suffice for the diagnosis. It's all the matter of personal opinion. I can say you have no empathy while you can argue that you care only for those who are worthy of your time. How I view your character can let me judge you as a narcissist while you can say you don't have to cater to the needy people or psychic vampires.
The supposedly narcissistic traits are debatable. While there is no room for the debate in the case of autism or Asperger's syndrome. I mean it's impossible not to tell the difference between a healthy kid and an autistic one. It doesn't depend on "how you personally look at it."
The Forum post is edited by Anna May 25 '21
Tom Riddle
May 26 '21
A common thing with all personality disorders is childhood relations. Narcissistic personality disorders can come from the child being raised to be king or queen. This is why people from curling generation demonstrates such immature behavior. They don't understand that they can be wrong about something and they get agressive if things are not going their way. This is especially the girls as we live in a gynocentric society where children are raised with feminism.
The Forum post is edited by Tom Riddle May 26 '21
Wolfie
May 26 '21
Let me clarify that saying this - "It's possible to be a Satanist and not display Narcissism or Antisocial Personality Disorder" - is very different from saying this: "No Satanists in my experience have displayed Narcissism or Antisocial Personality Disorder."
I have definitely encountered Satanists who would probably be diagnosed with Narcissism or Antisocial Personality Disorder. But I've also encountered others who wouldn't, unless the psychologist was some sort of fluffy bunny who expects reality to be a Disney movie. And that brings us to Anna's excellent point about the subjectivity of these diagnoses.
I'll acknowledge, because it's demonstrably true, that Satanism attracts jerks and assholes. Any mode of thought that teaches the absurdity of socially imposed moral codes will attract people who want more than anything to be given permission to act like jerks and assholes. What these people don't understand, or else willfully ignore, is this: it isn't only the morality principle that compels such behaviors as common courtesy and fair and honest discourse. In fact sometimes the morality principle will compel the exact opposite of those. Meanwhile, the pleasure and reality principles are often quite conducive to non-jerk and non-asshole ways of interacting.
Tom Riddle
May 26 '21
Let me clarify that saying this - "It's possible to be a Satanist and not display Narcissism or Antisocial Personality Disorder" - is very different from saying this: "No Satanists in my experience have displayed Narcissism or Antisocial Personality Disorder."
I have definitely encountered Satanists who would probably be diagnosed with Narcissism or Antisocial Personality Disorder. But I've also encountered others who wouldn't, unless the psychologist was some sort of fluffy bunny who expects reality to be a Disney movie. And that brings us to Anna's excellent point about the subjectivity of these diagnoses.
I'll acknowledge, because it's demonstrably true, that Satanism attracts jerks and assholes. Any mode of thought that teaches the absurdity of socially imposed moral codes will attract people who want more than anything to be given permission to act like jerks and assholes. What these people don't understand, or else willfully ignore, is this: it isn't only the morality principle that compels such behaviors as common courtesy and fair and honest discourse. In fact sometimes the morality principle will compel the exact opposite of those. Meanwhile, the pleasure and reality principles are often quite conducive to non-jerk and non-asshole ways of interacting.
My theory is that Satanism on the basic attracts people with childhood trauma. Childhood trauma is also what causes personality disorders such as sociopathy and narcissism. However, the childhood trauma of Satanists seems not to be the same as the childhood of narcissists. People who actually are Satanists (meaning they are religious) do not have that kind of anti-social behavior. It's likely they have even got treatment for their trauma or that the satanic rituals makes them able to release their "evil" without breaking social norms. LaVey for instance argue that the destruction ritual for revenge is a tool for the Satanist to avenge himself without getting into social troubles or jail.
As I stated earlier being your own god does NOT mean you are a narcissist. It's quite opposite. If you are your own god then you acknowledge that you alone are responsible for your fate. There is no room for victimhood in that kind of worldview.
The Forum post is edited by Tom Riddle May 26 '21
Wolfie
May 26 '21
Tom, I have no data on whether Satanists in general have experienced childhood trauma. I guess first we'd have to agree on what constitutes childhood trauma. Here again we face the subjectivity problem that Anna highlighted. My sister would tell you she was traumatized by our mother. Yet if you heard the relevant stories, you might not agree that they were traumatic. I certainly don't. Meanwhile, I was bullied in school and view it as traumatic, yet some could argue that I created my own problem by mishandling the situation, and to be honest, I agree. I was a young kid who was not receiving any sort of legitimate guidance from the responsible adults, but nevertheless, I mishandled the situation.
As for being your own god, I just hate the phrase, because of the erroneous conclusions any normal person would draw. If you say you worship yourself, then a normal person would conclude that you have an altar (or something similar) dedicated to yourself, with a photo of yourself (or something similar) prominently positioned on it, and you light candles and burn incense to honor yourself, and you offer prayers of praise, thanksgiving, supplication and contrition to yourself, and perhaps you even offer little rice cakes to yourself, or maybe chicken wings. I'm sure you don't do any of that. But the words you choose to use would imply such behaviors.
You've also said twice now that you're responsible for your own fate. That is simply not the case. Luck and other people have a great deal of power in your life, as they do in everyone's. What you're responsible for is your own behavior, and evaluating your own behavior (and its outcomes) with ruthless honesty, and modifying your own behavior with ruthless self-mastery when you want something different from what you've gotten thus far. Yet even with all of that, you could still go out on the road and be hit head-on by a drunk driver and die on the spot.
Tom Riddle
May 26 '21
Tom, I have no data on whether Satanists in general have experienced childhood trauma. I guess first we'd have to agree on what constitutes childhood trauma. Here again we face the subjectivity problem that Anna highlighted. My sister would tell you she was traumatized by our mother. Yet if you heard the relevant stories, you might not agree that they were traumatic. I certainly don't. Meanwhile, I was bullied in school and view it as traumatic, yet some could argue that I created my own problem by mishandling the situation, and to be honest, I agree. I was a young kid who was not receiving any sort of legitimate guidance from the responsible adults, but nevertheless, I mishandled the situation.
Trauma is an emotional experience yes but it does not change how it effects. We have seen cases how forexample bulling lead to school massacre. If a person have been into sexual abuse as a child then it in fact leads to trauma. Their voices forexample are effected as people with intreated childhood trauma have the voice of a child based on the age they were abused.
Tom, I have no data on whether Satanists in general have experienced childhood trauma. I guess first we'd have to agree on what constitutes childhood trauma. Here again we face the subjectivity problem that Anna highlighted. My sister would tell you she was traumatized by our mother. Yet if you heard the relevant stories, you might not agree that they were traumatic. I certainly don't. Meanwhile, I was bullied in school and view it as traumatic, yet some could argue that I created my own problem by mishandling the situation, and to be honest, I agree. I was a young kid who was not receiving any sort of legitimate guidance from the responsible adults, but nevertheless, I mishandled the situation.
As for being your own god, I just hate the phrase, because of the erroneous conclusions any normal person would draw. If you say you worship yourself, then a normal person would conclude that you have an altar (or something similar) dedicated to yourself, with a photo of yourself (or something similar) prominently positioned on it, and you light candles and burn incense to honor yourself, and you offer prayers of praise, thanksgiving, supplication and contrition to yourself
When Satanists says "Hail Satan" at the end of ritual or ceremony then it's to me a keyword for "Hail us". The worship of Satan is therefore a psychodrama of self-worship since Satan is the externalized ego of the Satanist. That's how Satanists gathers into a tribe that cooperates.
You've also said twice now that you're responsible for your own fate. That is simply not the case.
You are not responsible for being abused as a child but you are responsible for getting treatment for that abuse. What you are promoting here is victimhood. People who choose to look at themselves as victims will always be victims. They want instead the society shall change for their personal need while we Satanists refuses to see us selves as victims. I have been treated unfair all my life and being treated like trash but still refuse victimhood. I have also learned that society and nature don't give to shit about a man's issues so I can choose to cry all the time or I can choose to work on my personal development and self-transformation to become more powerful because power is what life is all about.
The Forum post is edited by Tom Riddle May 26 '21
Anna
May 26 '21
"My theory is that Satanism on the basic attracts people with childhood trauma."
I want to know what empirical evidence do you have to support your claims. I assume you must know the majority of Satanists personally and must know them very well since you're able to draw such conclusions. What do you know about the events from the childhood of the users here? Please share what you know.
Also, saying that you're not responsible for everything that happens to you is not embracing victimhood. It's simply being realistic. There are things in life that are beyond our control. What you can control are your reactions to them.
Your psychological projections are quite pathetic. Just because you feel you were treated like shit and abused when you were a kid, it doesn't mean the majority of Satanists had that kind of a problem. Unless, as I wrote earlier, you have proofs to back up your revelations.
The Forum post is edited by Anna May 26 '21
Wolfie
May 26 '21
Tom, I'm responsible for what I can control, and I'm not responsible for what I can't. That's simply the case. No amount of philosophizing can change it.
For any aspect of my reality, either I'm responsible, or someone else is, or no one is (it's sheer luck). Me, others, luck. Learning to parse out the correct domains for each of those three is a key component of the maturation process. Each of us is engaged in a lifelong maturation process.
If someone walks up behind me and stabs me, that person is responsible for the injuries I sustain. What I, however, am responsible for is how I react, both in the short term and the long term.
I get the impression that not seeing yourself as a victim is a very important component of your maturation process at the current time, and I think for the most part you're on the right track. I would just suggest that you can acknowledge having been victimized while simultaneously refusing to remain in the position of victim. That's the crux of the matter: refusing to remain in the position of victim. Taking back as much of your power as you can.
It sounds to me like you're making good use of Satanic ritual. I feel like it's helpful to you. Certainly where childhood trauma is concerned, a vengeance ritual can be cathartic, and that catharsis can move your maturation process forward.
I don't personally view Satan as myself. I don't view him as any sort of entity. I see him as the personification of - hmm - I'm going to say something I wouldn't have said before writing this post and thinking through certain elements of it - I see Satan as the personification of a successful maturation process.
Maturation starts at conception and ends at death. There is no part of life that isn't part of the maturation process. Successful maturation yields a steady increase in adaptability to circumstances both environmental and biological.
More to follow on this.
Aborior Translatione
May 26 '21
No Scientology attracts people with childhood trauma.
Gotta work on those engrams.
Joking aside.
I have almost every personality disorder. Or pass the criteria to be diagnosed and medicated for almost all of them.
Most glaringly "Oppositional Defiant Disorder", which today is billion dollar way to medicate adolescence.
Your psychological projections are quite pathetic. Just because you feel you were treated like shit and abused when you were a kid, it doesn't mean the majority of Satanists had that kind of a problem. Unless, as I wrote earlier, you have some kind of a proof to back up your revelations.
Mine makes every kid of lesser privilege and poverty want to go back in time and kick the shit out of me. And because I'm also a narcissist you are going to read my anecdote.
I had the Almost Famous mom without The Catholic School. Same psychology degree. She made the entire crux of her parenting to make us "think apart", to be different. And this translated into forbidding us from social trends.
All the friends got GT or Pre-buyout mongoose BMX bikes and she goes and gets me an imported French one with a coaster brake. That I was lucky enough to get a bike is lost because yet again my mom was micromanaging my ability to operate. My sister argues this as a form psychological abuse but I cant see it is as trauma. I just didn't like the attempt to lead my thinking about the importance of fitting in.
In my mind I saw these things as necessary for my ability to be a kid and she might as well have named me Sue in this regard. I had to explain why I had off brands and defend my not fitting in, and I resented her for knowingly and deliberately putting me in that position.
So I took away things she wanted like, "senior photos", "prom photos", "strait A's" (like the sister I blew away on IOWA tests and was expected to surpass), and "graduating". I systematically removed all the things she, as a parent, looked forward to to punish her approach. And had I not been so combative I wouldn't be the never-achieving burnout I am today.
I fought privilege because I didn't like her trying to make me an independent thinker at every turn.
And in the world where she pushed religion I would have fought that. Today I agree with her, but when I was a kid she was just a hater not letting me wear absurd 90s clothing.
Could have been rich if I didn't have a lifelong problem with authority and positive reinforcement for expected behavior. I didn't want the reward for making her proud. I enjoyed the opposite actually. And that translated to the rest of life.
The Forum post is edited by Aborior Translatione May 26 '21
Tom Riddle
May 26 '21
"My theory is that Satanism on the basic attracts people with childhood trauma."
I want to know what empirical evidence do you have to support your claims. I assume you must know the majority of Satanists personally and must know them very well since you're able to draw such conclusions. What do you know about the events from the childhood of the users here? Please share what you know.
I have been into the satanic community for a decade now both on Facebook and other forums. Many of them have looks that demonstrates something happened to them in their childhood. People who have been abused often have some physical traits which forexample can be a lot of piercings in face, blue hair or black lips, a lot of visible tattoos. The way people presents themselves is not random but have a reason that can be traced back to childhood. Our relations in childhood have a lot of influence on how we behaves as adults.
Thomas LeRoy actually have similar theory based on the term the one who shocks awakes. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rSQFwamM9SY
Your psychological projections are quite pathetic. Just because you feel you were treated like shit and abused when you were a kid, it doesn't mean the majority of Satanists had that kind of a problem. Unless, as I wrote earlier, you have proofs to back up your revelations.
It's not projection. It's honesty. I don't deny or suppress my experiences in childhood to adult. I believe many are not honesty because they either see it as weakness or they have suppressed it into their subconsciousness.
The Forum post is edited by Tom Riddle May 26 '21
Tom Riddle
May 26 '21
Tom, I'm responsible for what I can control, and I'm not responsible for what I can't.
If I see the report that it's going to rain I take my raincoat with me. When I know that I will be banned from social media if I say something political incorrect then I use keywords or other that will avoid me getting banned. If I have a knife on me in the night then I have a chance to defend myself against an attacker. Some people instead becomes part of a mob, trying to change the world. These are people who have an ideal above themselves while I have no ideal above myself.
You can control your fate if you uses tools such as science, reason, logic, applied philosophy, ritual etc.
The Forum post is edited by Tom Riddle May 26 '21
